Re: Extract number from character field(Perl syntax) (wayyofftopic) -- MIDRANGE-L

Comments in line

boldt@ca.ibm.com wrote:

> Jim wrote:
> >First, I don't consider RPG to be big at all.  Languages I would consider
> >to be "big" would be C, BASIC, Pascal, FORTRAN and COBOL.  There
> >are some other languages that a "big" but not quite as much, such as ADA,
> >LISP, Forth and the like.
>
> You're a brave man to state on this mailing list that RPG
> is not big.  It's by far the most popular language on the
> most popular midrange system.  I've read that it's probably
> the most commonly used language for business applications.

I would have to say that the most commonly used language for business
applications is C.  There are FAR more PC business applications out there
then there are RPG applications.  By a long shot.

"It's by far the most popular language on the most popular midrange system",
by that are you saying, "On the most popular midrange system it is the most
popular language"?  And that I would have to agree with.  But then again,
The majority of computers in the world are not midrange systems.

The most poplar language on a McDonnell Douglas mini-main frame was
Pick Basic, but that ain't saying much 8-)

> I wouldn't consider Pascal big anymore.

Pascal is coming down in size, but it is still big.  Check out the Delphi
newsgroups
sometime.

> Have you tried learning Perl?  There's a lot of good
> information available on the internet.  Also, several
> excellent books published by O'Reilly.  Start with
> "Learning Perl", then move up to "Programming Perl".

Yes, I can use Perl if I HAVE to.  I went through a few tutorials
on the internet to learn it, and I did not find it intuitive at all.  I was also
helping a Perl programmer debug their Perl scripts.  This was someone
who was using Perl for quite a while and couldn't find the bug.  Here I
had been using Perl for less than a few weeks and found their bug.
It's not a matter of not being able to decipher it, but the fact that it does
have to be deciphered to be figured out.

> The hardest part of Perl for those not familiar with
> the Unix world is probably regular expressions.  For
> me, well, before I looked at Perl, I didn't have a
> very good understanding of regular expressions.  But
> after reading the books and writing a few programs, I
> think I've got a good handle on the subject.  Some
> things are simply harder to learn than others.

I don't' feel I need to learn something such as "regular expressions" if
it's only going to be used in one or two langauges/platforms.  On the
other hand, learning pointers, functions, subroutines, etc... can be used
in almost all languages, one way or another.  Just as I hated LOGO with
it's use of (((((left))))((and))(((((right))))((parenthesis)))))).

> >Java will become big if it becomes easier to figure out.  Java does
> >have the advantage that it looks a bit like C code.  It is not impossible
> >for a non Java programming to figure out what a Java program is
> >doing, just difficult.
>
> The difficult part of a language like Java is
> understanding the object relationships.  OO is
> fundamental to Java, and learning OO is not always
> easy.

OO is fine, because it can be used in quite a number of languages.  In fact,
I've used OO in Delphi, VB, some VC++   Java MAY become big, if someone
makes a GOOD compiler for it, which will bring it up a generation or two.

> BTW, Perl can do OO quite nicely.  Actually, I've
> always said that dynamic, typeless languages like
> Perl or Object Rexx are the ones best suited to OO.

I don't know Rexx so can't say anything about it.  Never saw it.

> >But, a non Perl programming looking at Perl has absolutely no idea
> >what is going on.
>
> To repeat, someone who doesn't know RPG wouldn't have
> a clue either when looking at an RPG program for the
> first time.

I looked at a RPG program for the first time about 4 years ago, it did
not take me long to figure out what it was doing.  I was modifying S36
RPG code inside of 2 weeks.

> Here's where you and I really differ.  I find Perl a
> lot of fun.  Using Perl, you can write very powerful
> programs in a very short time.

I think this has to do with the mentality of the Linux world.  I have a
Linux system at home I installed, and I had complained to someone
that every time I tried to install a package it complained about missing
dependencies.  His reply was that's what made it so fun.  So after
downloading the program I wanted, downloading one dependency
then finding out IT had a dependency, I downloaded THAT dependency
installed it, installed the previous dependency then the original program
I wanted.  This was a XWindows IRC client.  Took me about 4 hours.
When I wanted one for Windows I download mIRC and installed it.

Spending 4 hours to do something that can be done in 1/2 hour is not
my idea of "fun".

> You've read the story about the UCLA programming
> contest where the winner decidedly trounced all others
> by using Perl?  The organizers of the contest banned
> Perl from subsequent contests!  (The winner said he
> didn't know what to do with his prize - a copy of MS
> Visual C++!)

Why not program in Assembly?  Isn't it the most powerful there is?
But there are very few Assembly programmers out there.

> Someone once told me:  "There are two type of people:
> those who like APL and those who haven't been properly
> introduced to it."  I think the same could apply to
> Perl.

How many APL programmers do you know around today?  In fact,
I went looking for an APL compiler for my Windows box a few years
back.  Didn't come up with anything.

> >I could be wrong, and Perl can become used more than any other
> >language, but I don't see it happening.  There will always be the minority
> >who will use it, and the people who will learn it to get another notch
> >in their belt, but the majority of programmers I think will stay away
> >from it.
>
> As more and more people use Perl for their CGI apps,
> they will recognize how useful Perl can be in other
> application domains.

In today's world, just because something is better doesn't make it more
popular.  Heck, look at Windows.

> BTW, just so no one thinks I'm being unfaithful to
> RPG, I don't see Perl replacing RPG for business
> applications.  Lack of good decimal arithmetic alone
> will prevent that.
>
> Cheers!  Hans

Regards,

Jim Langston

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