RE: webfacing JD Edwards ( -- WEB400

Chuck

I've looked at different iSeries legacy application and the available
options for integrating those apps to the web and the good news is that
there are several excellent ways to bring legacy applications to the web ,
integrate to a unified corporate system and give legacy development teams a
way to keep in synch with the new technologies.

We looked mainly at two different methodologies here, screen scraping and
migrating.
Screen scraping offers a way to extend green screen systems to the web and
then manipulate the inputs and outputs like a database (think Jacada).
Migrating means taking those green screens and converting them to JSPs and
Java using a conversion tool without modifying the underlying applicaiton.

Websphere webfacing is recommended not only because it costs less than
screenscraping, has a shorter development time and runs faster but also
because it opens a path to migrate out of your legacy solution in an
iterative process  that can match the businss pace.

For instance, once you have webfaced you can take the generated code and
add your own JSP custom tag library (read:incorporate corporate design
easily), connect to other databases, make on screen mods, change the
underlying code with java calls etc.

Importantly webfacing fits most enterprise strategies by keeping the data
and business rules more closely aligned, leverages existing assets and is a
step towards a single enterprise solution. As a technology that uses Java
and websphere, it's a migration, not another layer and you already own the
tool to do it.

Webfacing is, as such, an iterative migration process that will open your
iSeries to one of its strongest asset - web serving and will leverage your
already considerable investment in that system.

Yes, its astounding how we still use the iSeries like it's an old jalopy,
but as you start  tinkering with websphere and webfacing, the possibilities
to provide your customers with  superior solutions becomes more and more
apparent and the results will be obvious.

One of the best benefits of webfacing is that it works out of the box. You
could have all your users on the web tomorrow. OK, that's an exageration in
reality- as your users might want to be trained,  some keywords need
reconfiguring etc.  but it is true that it works straight out of the box
and you can then modify those screens to change the order of the
fields,styles, insert combo boxes, radio buttons with little or no
training.

I'll address some of the issues below. But the short answer to your
questions:
1.  You don't absolutely need a consultant - give yourself the gift of
knowledge by doing it yourself. If you need to bring in a consultant to
answer all your questions, make sure they are a java, oo, WAS, WSAD
(studio), IBM Toolbox guru and can deconstruct the generated code from
webfacing - not just someone who knows how to do webfacing (that can be
learned in an afternoon).

2.  Read  "The IBM Webfacing Tool" to show you how to webface.
see http://www-1.ibm.com/servers/enable/site/ebiz/webfacing/start.html for
more Webfacing resources

3 Put your free copy of Websphere Studio on every developer's desktop and
go through the tutorials

4. Start a path to transform your developers into a Java and OO team. Give
yourself a year. Bring in a training company that will help you make the
transition over a period of time, e.g. One class every quarter with
workshops in between.

THE IRONIC THING.
Webfacing scares many and many more think it's too good to be true. This is
why you may have a hard time convincing senior management that they don't
have to go out and spend a $100K on a third party package. The sales teams
from vendors will come up with a million reasons to buy their product.
Worse, by choosing an inhouse solution you are putting all the risk on your
plate. We all know about corporate insecurity - there is that unspoken
assumption that another company can do a better job than you can.

I encourage you to ask around and get other's experiences - my experience
that inhouse web transformation of legacy apps through webfacing works and
works exceedingly well in a number of configurations. We have our legacy
apps on our iseries, the webfacing code running on an AIX Websphere App
server in another city talking to those legacy apps with our static content
from another server. That's about as complicated as a scenario as you can
find - but it all runs very smoothly. We did upgrade our old 700 box though
for performance (see below).

SOME ARGUMENTS
Read the excellent article  by ted jensen 'TOP TEN THINGS TO HATE ABOUT
WEBFACING - and its response at
http://www.acsltd.com/Web/cmshome.nsf/attachmentweb/MGLY-5KHK9X/$file/Top+Ten+Things+To+Hate+About+WebFacing.pdf?OpenElement

SCREEN SCRAPING METHODOLOGIES
Let me address the screenscrapers like Jacada.
The irony of purchasing a screenscraping solution is that the very product
that brings legacy applications to the web is the same product that also
locks you back INTO your legacy apps.
Screenscrapers generally needs your legacy system in a fossilized state in
order for it to work. Additionaly when you DO make changes to the legacy
app you're faced with a triple maintenance assault on resources.  The
legacy engine, the screenscraper middleware and the front end that uses it.

Screen Bunching Argument.
Some people comment that Webfacing locks people into a single screen by
screen replication of your legacy whereas screenscrapers and others can
bunch several screens together.The simple answer is No - WSAD 5.1 allows
bunching.  The screen bunching thing is a bit of a red herring anyway.
Vendors says  their product an bunch screens together, but only where there
is a real redunancy in the input process. I question how it would be able
to bunch on screens depend on a previous choice or database update. For
example, if you enter data into screen A and depending on what you enter
then either B, C or screen D will appear next. Now regardless of how you
makewhat they call' trails;  in screen scrapers, If screen B popping up
depends on whay data being added to a table on screen A, then you simply
can't enter data into A and B at the same time. You can make a trail of it,
one can't happen without another input from the user.

Screenscrapers add layers.
At first glance, tools from other vendors appear to be a feature rich,
impressive screenscraping tool,
however once faced with all this middleware in between the user and busines
engine then it begins to look more like lumbering,expensive wedge from
which once attached may be quite difficultt to extricate yourself from.
Webfacing is a lean and mean solution which will migrate legacy apps to the
web in a controllable, extensible way.


YOU MAY NEED TO UPGRADE
Upgrading your iSeries
If you don't have a powerful enough machine, you will need to upgrade your
iSeries

- Nothing is faster than a green screen. It's a fact of life. If you put
Websphere App server on the iSeries, expect reduced response time. However
subsecond response time is still possible.

- Web access requires more processing power, memory and L2 Cache.  This is
true regardless of the method used to bring the application to the web.
Your  current configuration will impact  users through a noticeable
degradation in response time.

-  A minimum CPW (transaction power) of 1000 is recommended for WebSphere
application server.

-  Workload analysis typically shows a minimum DASD requirement of 175 GB
(yours may vary)

- The WebFacing Server must reside on the iSeries causing a heavier
workload.  Webssphere Application Server can reside anywhere but if it is
on your iSeries expect a chunk of resources eaten up.

- Increased transactions and heavier demands need to be accommodated. If
you're going to the web, expect more users.

- iSeries will continue to return a better Total Cost of Ownership than
comparable Windows or Unix servers but machine cost is higher if you are
thinking of going to another machine altogether.

- The upgrade will put you in a strong position to leverage  the system's
excellent web development and deployment capabilities and free you  from
legacy applications with better resources to iteratively migrate to Java.

- if you go for the zero CPW option you can get a super fast high end
iSeries at a savings from 30-150K. Zero CPW means you can not have any
green screens active anymore.

That's my two cents -  don't take my word for it. There are extensive chats
on this forum about webfacing - check them out for other people's opinions.

Regards

Colm Byrne
Senior Developer




web400-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx@midrange.com on 01/17/2004 01:00:25 PM

Please respond to web400@xxxxxxxxxxxx

Sent by:    web400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx


To:    web400@xxxxxxxxxxxx
cc:

Subject:    WEB400 Digest, Vol 2, Issue 15


Send WEB400 mailing list submissions to
 web400@xxxxxxxxxxxx

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
 http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/web400
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
 web400-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx

You can reach the person managing the list at
 web400-owner@xxxxxxxxxxxx

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of WEB400 digest..."


Today's Topics:

   1. RE: webfacing JD Edwards (Eric Kempter)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

message: 1
date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 14:24:28 -0800
from: "Eric Kempter" <EKempter@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
subject: RE: [WEB400] webfacing JD Edwards

Chuck,

     You may want to post your question on the jdedwards forum / mailing
     list at http://www.jdelist.com/forums.

 -----Original Message-----
From:       web400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:web400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx]  On Behalf Of Chuck Bower
Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 6:14 AM
To:   web400@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject:    [WEB400] webfacing JD Edwards

For the group:

Is anyone running a webfacing application in JD Edwards, or the whole JDE
application webfaced?

If so, did you do it yourselves, or have it done by a consultant?  What
webfacing application did you use?  How did you evaluate webfacing apps if
you are not using Websphere webfacing?

On a side note, has there ever been a survey done to get an idea of how
many
companies are using Websphere webfacing vs.. a 3rd party product?

Chuck Bower
_______________________________________________
This is the Web Enabling the AS400 / iSeries (WEB400) mailing list
To post a message email: WEB400@xxxxxxxxxxxx
To subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options,
visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/web400
or email: WEB400-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Before posting, please take a moment to review the archives
at http://archive.midrange.com/web400.







------------------------------

_______________________________________________
This is the Web Enabling the AS400 / iSeries (WEB400) digest list
To post a message email: WEB400@xxxxxxxxxxxx
To subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options,
visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/web400
or email: WEB400-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Before posting, please take a moment to review the archives
at http://archive.midrange.com/web400.



End of WEB400 Digest, Vol 2, Issue 15
*************************************