Re: Does the eRPG SDK template system support JSON?

[Jon Paris <jon.paris@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

COBOL is COBOL is COBOL to a very large extent.

The ANSI folks went off in an OO direction and never did anything like prototyping as best I know.

The big problem with a standards based language is that if you want to add anything new (e.g. protos) you have to spend an inordinate amount of time making sure that what you are adding will not subsequently conflict with any changes to the language standard. Admittedly since OO COBOL was almost universally ignored by everyone except MicroFocus there has been little push that I’ve seen in updating the language standard - but then I don’t follow those things any more.

So - likelihood of IBM adding protos to COBOL - probably as close to zero as anything.

IBM no longer places as much emphasis on COBOL as it did - in part I suspect because it does not seem to be a compulsory part of FIPS any more. At one time if your COBOL compiler did not meet FIPS standards you could not sell to government organizations - even if they did not intend to use COBOL! That requirement drove COBOL within IBM for many years.

 
Jon Paris

www.partner400.com
www.SystemiDeveloper.com

On May 13, 2015, at 9:50 AM, Charles Wilt <charles.wilt@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Jon,
> 
> No you explained that you'd have to define a X(10) field and move 'AB' to
> it.  :)
> 
> So if the caller is expecting X(10), to pass a literal AB, you'd have to
> pass 'AB        '...which is what I asked a few posts ago.
> 
> Surprised IBM hasn't added some sort of prototyping functionality to the
> linkage section.
> 
> Wonder if z/OS COBOL is any different...
> 
> Charles
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Wed, May 13, 2015 at 12:13 PM, Jon Paris <jon.paris@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> wrote:
> 
>> Thought I’d already explained that Charles but …
>> 
>> In RPG I would code the parm as (say) 10a Const. If I do that then passing
>> a literal of ‘A’ or ‘AB’ or … will result in a 10 character field being
>> passed with blanks in the back end.
>> 
>> In COBOL coding by CONTENT ‘A’  would pass a one character parm.   by
>> CONTENT ‘AB’ would pass a two character parm and so-on.  If the called
>> routine expects a 10 character parm then this is a problem.
>> 
>> 
>> Jon Paris
>> 
>> www.partner400.com
>> www.SystemiDeveloper.com
>> 
>> On May 13, 2015, at 5:32 AM, Charles Wilt <charles.wilt@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> 
>>> Jon,
>>> 
>>> So what happens here?
>>> 
>>> 
>> https://www-01.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/ssw_ibm_i_72/rzase/passing.htm
>>> If you want to pass a literal value to a called program, specify:
>>> 
>>> CALL…BY CONTENT literal
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Charles
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Wed, May 13, 2015 at 1:03 AM, Jon Paris <jon.paris@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> In RPG IV if the Proto says 10a Const (or Value for that matter) and you
>>>> pass ‘A’ then the compiler creates a 10a area, copies the data to it
>> (i.e.
>>>> ‘A         ‘) and then passes the temp.
>>>> 
>>>> In COBOL I would have to define an X(10) field, move ‘A’ into it and
>> then
>>>> pass that.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Jon Paris
>>>> 
>>>> www.partner400.com
>>>> www.SystemiDeveloper.com
>>>> 
>>>> On May 12, 2015, at 7:36 PM, Charles Wilt <charles.wilt@xxxxxxxxx>
>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Brad said something (that I interpreted) to that effect.
>>>>> 
>>>>> How can you have a field the same length if you can pass a literal?
>>>>> 
>>>>> If the parm is 10A, and you want to pass 'HI' to you have to pass 'HI
>>>>> '?
>>>>> 
>>>>> I've never used COBOL on the i, but my first paid language was
>>>> COBOL...so I
>>>>> was curious enough to glance through than ILE COBOL manuals :)
>>>>> 
>>>>> Charles
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Tue, May 12, 2015 at 9:55 PM, Jon Paris <jon.paris@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Nobody said it did Charles.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I just said it was harder in COBOL because the compiler doesn’t do any
>>>>>> work for you.  Even BY CONTENT is not the same because the field
>> passed
>>>>>> still has to have the correct length and data type.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Jon Paris
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> www.partner400.com
>>>>>> www.SystemiDeveloper.com
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On May 12, 2015, at 5:07 PM, Charles Wilt <charles.wilt@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Just for the archive...the link Brad provided to a post by Bruce has:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> "If your RPG procedure prototypes a parameter as VALUE you’ll use BY
>>>>>> VALUE
>>>>>>> in COBOL. If the prototype has CONST you’ll use BY CONTENT. And if
>>>>>> neither
>>>>>>> VALUE or CONST, use BY REFERENCE. GIVING identifies the procedures
>>>> RETURN
>>>>>>> value."
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> The programmers guide shows:
>>>>>>> CALL…BY CONTENT identifier
>>>>>>> CALL…BY CONTENT literal
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I'm a little confused by this statement in the language reference
>>>>>> regarding
>>>>>>> BY CONTENT Phrase - "The number of characters in each parameter must
>> be
>>>>>>> equal; however, the data descriptions need not be the same."
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Also seems that COBOL supports omittable parms also.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> So I don't see any indication that CONST on an RPG param prevents
>>>> calling
>>>>>>> by COBOL.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Charles
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Mon, May 11, 2015 at 11:58 PM, Bradley Stone <bvstone@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I wondered the same thing, Henrick.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I haven't done COBOL since the 90s but a search shows this answer
>> from
>>>>>>>> Bruce Vinning:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>> 
>> http://itknowledgeexchange.techtarget.com/itanswers/calling-rpg-proc-from-cobol-ile/
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I guess I just assumed that with ILE things worked as ILE... If
>> CONST
>>>>>> ruins
>>>>>>>> that relationship maybe it should be more "publicized".  :)  I plan
>>>> too
>>>>>>>> look further into this issue that's for sure as it's the first I've
>>>>>> heard
>>>>>>>> of it.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Brad
>>>>>>>> www.bvstools.com
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 11, 2015 at 2:03 AM, Henrik Rützou <hr@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> I know nothing about COBOL interface to RPG service programs, what
>> is
>>>>>>>>> the difference (besides the /copybook) ?
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 11, 2015 at 5:04 AM, Kelly Cookson <
>>>> KCookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks Jon. There are a number of tools for mobile development on
>>>> the
>>>>>>>> IBM
>>>>>>>>>> i.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> However, our shop has decided to develop mobile client interfaces
>>>>>> using
>>>>>>>>>> responsive web sites and hybrid apps (Cordorva/PhoneGap). This is
>>>>>>>> because
>>>>>>>>>> all of our current mobile developers are coming from a background
>> of
>>>>>>>>>> Microsoft .NET web development. Our shop has spent years
>> developing
>>>>>>>>>> websites that connect to the IBM i using web services written in
>>>> .NET
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>> using the .NET Data Provider.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> For our IBM i COBOL developers (including myself) to become web
>> and
>>>>>>>>> mobile
>>>>>>>>>> developers, we will have to use HTML5, CSS3, JavaScript, AJAX,
>> JSON
>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>> Cordova/PhoneGap to develop client interfaces. I was hoping to use
>>>>>>>>> Node.JS
>>>>>>>>>> on the IBM i to give our COBOL developers a path to web services
>>>>>>>> without
>>>>>>>>>> having to learn .NET. Node.JS isn't going to work for us at this
>>>> time.
>>>>>>>>> But
>>>>>>>>>> we can: (a) use our shop's standard technologies to develop web
>> and
>>>>>>>>> mobile
>>>>>>>>>> client interfaces, and (b) hook up the client interfaces to web
>>>>>>>> services
>>>>>>>>>> developed with COBOL CGI programs. This gets our IBM i COBOL
>>>>>> developers
>>>>>>>>>> into web and mobile development without having to learn .NET, and
>> it
>>>>>>>>>> leverages our existing expertise in COBOL.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> I have designed an architecture for CGI programming on the IBM i
>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>> conforms to REST architectural constraints as described in
>>>> Fielding's
>>>>>>>>>> dissertation. I am now gathering information on tools available to
>>>>>> help
>>>>>>>>> us
>>>>>>>>>> with the COBOL CGI programming. Next step, proof of concepts...
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>> Kelly
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>> From: WEB400 [mailto:web400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
>> Jon
>>>>>>>> Paris
>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2015 9:36 PM
>>>>>>>>>> To: Web400@Midrange. Web400
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [WEB400] Does the eRPG SDK template system support
>>>> JSON?
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> For Mobile development with COBOL you should really take a look at
>>>>>>>>> Lansa's
>>>>>>>>>> LongRange http://www.longrangemobile.com
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> I know that works pretty well with COBOL because I helped
>> translate
>>>> a
>>>>>>>> few
>>>>>>>>>> of the RPG examples into COBOL.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Jon Paris
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> www.partner400.com
>>>>>>>>>> www.SystemiDeveloper.com
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> On May 10, 2015, at 8:00 PM, Kelly Cookson <KCookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> 
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> I will look for the template system in CGICBLDEV2 when I get it
>>>>>>>>>> installed and start playing around with it.
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> I literally just started looking at CGI tools. I recently learned
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>> our shop will not be adopting Node.JS on the IBM i at any time in
>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> foreseeable future. Kind of a bummer. But the same reasons for
>> not
>>>>>>>>>>> adopting Node.JS make CGI using COBOL programs an attractive
>>>>>>>>>>> alternative. (Every shop is different, and I'm sure Node.JS will
>>>> work
>>>>>>>>>>> wonderfully for a lot of shops. It's just not a good fit for us
>> at
>>>>>>>>>>> this time.)
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm still committed to helping our IBM i COBOL developers become
>>>> web
>>>>>>>>>>> and mobile developers as well. ;-)
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>>> Kelly
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>> From: WEB400 [mailto:web400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
>> Jon
>>>>>>>>>>> Paris
>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2015 7:30 PM
>>>>>>>>>>> To: Web400@Midrange. Web400
>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [WEB400] Does the eRPG SDK template system support
>>>> JSON?
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> CGICBLDEV2 uses a template system too Kelly.
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> Jon Paris
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> www.partner400.com
>>>>>>>>>>> www.SystemiDeveloper.com
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> On May 10, 2015, at 12:55 PM, Kelly Cookson
>> <KCookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks Jon. I am looking at CGICBLDEV2 as well. And I'm looking
>> at
>>>>>>>>>> other solutions such as the CGI interface to XMLSERVICE and
>> iWebSrv.
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> The thing I like about eRPG SDK is the use of a template system
>> to
>>>>>>>>>> format data for return to the client. This seems to me a
>> potentially
>>>>>>>>>> intuitive way for developers who only do COBOL and DDS to deal
>> with
>>>>>>>>>> returning JSON data. Still, I am also looking at other options for
>>>>>> JSON
>>>>>>>>>> with COBOL (YAJL, PowerEXT, Redvers COBOL JSPN Interface).
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> The client interfaces we develop will using jQuery AJAX to make
>>>> GET
>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>> POST requests, and they will be expecting data formatted in JSON
>> as
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> response. By keep the contract between the client and the web
>>>> service
>>>>>>>>>> uniform (AJAX GET and POST requests, JSON responses) we can
>> develop
>>>>>>>>> client
>>>>>>>>>> interfaces that can easily switch between IBM i back ends and
>>>> Windows
>>>>>>>>> back
>>>>>>>>>> ends. We just need to point the client to a new URL to switch back
>>>>>>>> ends.
>>>>>>>>>> This is one of the benefits of the uniform interface constraint of
>>>>>>>>> RESTful
>>>>>>>>>> architecture.
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>>>> Kelly
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>> From: WEB400 [mailto:web400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
>>>> Jon
>>>>>>>>>>>> Paris
>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2015 10:23 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>> To: Web400@Midrange. Web400
>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [WEB400] Does the eRPG SDK template system support
>>>>>>>> JSON?
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> Kelly,
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> You might want to also look at the COBOL interfaces for CGIDEV2
>> (
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.easy400.net/cgicbldev2p/start.pgm).
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> No disrespect to Brad's eRPG but some RPG-oriented interfaces
>> can
>>>> be
>>>>>>>>>> very difficult to use in COBOL. Reason, in part, is that such
>>>> routines
>>>>>>>>> tend
>>>>>>>>>> to take advantage of the facilities offered by prototypes - for
>>>>>> example
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> keyword CONST allows you to specify a literal instead of a
>> variable.
>>>>>>>>> COBOL
>>>>>>>>>> has no such option and therefore the fields usually need to be
>>>> passed
>>>>>>>>>> exactly as specified in the called routine. That usually requires
>>>>>>>> quite a
>>>>>>>>>> bit more work and makes the examples hard to follow.
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> Giovanni has already done the grunt work and provided documented
>>>>>>>>> native
>>>>>>>>>> COBOL interfaces to CGIDEV2 routines that make it much easier.
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> Just a thought.  Unless Brad has added a lot of new stuff to
>> eRPG
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>> I am unaware of, I think that the capabilities of CGIDEV2 are a
>>>> close
>>>>>>>>> match.
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> Jon Paris
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> www.partner400.com
>>>>>>>>>>>> www.SystemiDeveloper.com
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> On May 10, 2015, at 10:46 AM, Kelly Cookson
>> <KCookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks Brad.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I assume I wouldn't have any problems implementing this in ILE
>>>>>>>> COBOL.
>>>>>>>>>> I've seen several tutorial examples of creating JSON in RPG, which
>>>> is
>>>>>>>>> made
>>>>>>>>>> easier by built-in functions (like trim) and by  the new +=
>>>> assignment
>>>>>>>>>> operator. Unfortunately, RPG is not a standard language in our
>> shop.
>>>>>> So
>>>>>>>>> I'd
>>>>>>>>>> need to use eRPG SDK in ILE COBOL.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kelly
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: WEB400 [mailto:web400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bradley Stone
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2015 8:10 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: Web Enabling the IBM i (AS/400 and iSeries)
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [WEB400] Does the eRPG SDK template system support
>>>>>>>> JSON?
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi, Kelly.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The eRPG SDK is a template designed system, so if you create
>> JSON
>>>>>>>>>> templates the eRPG SDK would work the same as if it was using XML,
>>>>>>>> HTML,
>>>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>>>>> pretty much anything else.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> It doesn't know what type of data you're creating using the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> templates and replacement variables.  :)
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Brad
>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.bvstools.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Sun, May 10, 2015 at 2:15 AM, Kelly Cookson
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <KCookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Suppose I want to develop a CGI program in ILE COBOL using
>> eRPG
>>>>>>>> SDK.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Can the ILE COBOL program read a DB2 table and use the eRPG
>> SDK
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> template system to return a JSON string?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kelly Cookson
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> IT Project Leader
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dot Foods, Inc.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1.217.773.4486 ext. 12676
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> kcookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:kcookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is the Web Enabling the IBM i (AS/400 and iSeries)
>> (WEB400)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mailing list To post a message email: WEB400@xxxxxxxxxxxx To
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/web400
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>>>>>>>> take a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> moment to review the archives at
>>>>>>>> http://archive.midrange.com/web400
>>>>>>>>> .
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is the Web Enabling the IBM i (AS/400 and iSeries)
>> (WEB400)
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>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
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>>>>>>>>>>>>> moment to review the archives at
>>>>>>>> http://archive.midrange.com/web400.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>> This is the Web Enabling the IBM i (AS/400 and iSeries) (WEB400)
>>>>>>>>>>>> mailing list To post a message email: WEB400@xxxxxxxxxxxx To
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>>>>>>>>>>>> moment to review the archives at
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>>>>>>>> .
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>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>> This is the Web Enabling the IBM i (AS/400 and iSeries) (WEB400)
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>>>>>>>> .
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> --
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>>>>>>>>>>> mailing list To post a message email: WEB400@xxxxxxxxxxxx To
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>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> --
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>>>>>>>>>>> mailing list To post a message email: WEB400@xxxxxxxxxxxx To
>>>>>>>>>>> subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options,
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>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> This is the Web Enabling the IBM i (AS/400 and iSeries) (WEB400)
>>>>>>>> mailing
>>>>>>>>>> list To post a message email: WEB400@xxxxxxxxxxxx To subscribe,
>>>>>>>>>> unsubscribe, or change list options,
>>>>>>>>>> visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/web400
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>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> This is the Web Enabling the IBM i (AS/400 and iSeries) (WEB400)
>>>>>>>> mailing
>>>>>>>>>> list
>>>>>>>>>> To post a message email: WEB400@xxxxxxxxxxxx
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>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>> Henrik Rützou
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> http://powerEXT.com <http://powerext.com/>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> This is the Web Enabling the IBM i (AS/400 and iSeries) (WEB400)
>>>>>> mailing
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>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> --
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>>>>>> 
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